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Report on police use of lethal force

Former Supreme Court justice outlines 84 recommendations

The almost 350-page report extensively outlines ways the Toronto police can best deal with those having an emotional or mental crisis without having to use lethal force.

Retired Supreme Court of Canada justice Frank Iacobucci consulted with former police officers and other forces around the world to build the 84 recommendation "Police Encounters with People in Crisis."

Some of the recommendations include:

• have Toronto Police revise it's Use of Force policy to minimize the use of lethal force and use it as a last resort, stressing the importance of keeping people alive;
• start a pilot project that would give Tasers to some front-line officers who would also be equipped with body-cameras;
• consider expanding the Mobile Crisis Intervention Teams to have one available per division and if they should be available 24-hours a day. These teams include a uniformed officer and a nurse;
• have Toronto Police create a police and mental health oversight body that includes membership from the force and hospitals;
• educate officers on available mental health resources;
• have officers complete a mandatory mental health first aid course;
• recruit new officers with experience with the mental health community as well as demonstrate community-mindedness. Police should include psychologists in the recruitment process;
• consider creating a quick-reference checklist for when officers deal with people in crisis;
• consider decentralized training which is platoon-specific;
• have a 'Mental Health Champion' - one supervisor in each division experienced in these issues;
• create incentives and reward officers who properly use de-escalation techniques;
• have the force acknowledge and emphasize the importance of psychological wellness among officers;
• create an advisory committee on how best to implement these recommendations.

These are only recommendations. Police Chief Bill Blair has said it will be used as a blueprint on how the force will move forward.

One recommendation that has already been implemented is the launch of an advisory committee.

“We have taken this recommendation to heart and believe by immediate implementation, we can start the important work if implementing the other recommendations,” said Blair.

It's made up of people representing hospitals, community mental health organizations, police and those with lived experience of mental illness.

NEWSTALK 1010 spoke to Steve Lurie, the executive director of the Canadian Mental Health Association’s Toronto branch. He was named as one of the committee members and said some of the biggest issues will be underfunding and health care information sharing.

Lurie said there has been no initial meeting date planned.

The report recommends a follow-up review in five years.

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  • 53
  1. Frankie posted on 07/24/2014 11:07 AM
    How about adding -

    police aren't gods and if they tell you to do something and you don't that doesn't give them the right to shoot you 9 times if you're a containable threat

    when police see a citizen being beaten almost to death they must step in to protect that citizen and not stand by as spectators as they did in Caledonia. If the police refuse then the citizens have the right to use any means to protect themselves without prosecution
    1. Sonny posted on 07/24/2014 04:06 PM
      @Frankie Police need to be educated! You should taze someone before you have to shoot them several times not the other way around...
  2. dama posted on 07/24/2014 11:39 AM
    Bill Blair is his news conference said "He will move with these recommendations....."
    that is a good thing and he better..

    I like the body camera and not the tasers, for if 3 police officers start tasering the same guy , he will die too.. (Vancouver airport incident)

    With body camera, everything will be capture.. officer;s behaviour as well the mental person causing the disturbance.. ...

    Hopefully, if this is fully implemented,, less police shootings
  3. diane posted on 07/24/2014 11:52 AM
    Hi police in Caledonia are OPP and follow Government advice...need I say more about that.
    In terms of police training it's a lot more than 20 weeks. Once hired they have to partner up with an officer already in the force for one to two years + have regular physical medical tests every year to five years (not sure abt that one on timing). In training and on the force they have one week training every year. Training includes different situations that they must pass every day.(how to deal with different situations. Training never stops.
    1. dama posted on 07/24/2014 12:02 PM
      @diane Training never stops and from what had happened so far as reported in print and media....

      "Training includes different situations that they must pass every day.(how to deal with different situations. Training never stops."

      The above training as you had stated.. didn't work... hence the fast trigger....

      Implement the recommendations and use it as a benchmark going forward and let's see how it will work out.. .
    2. Mark7 posted on 07/24/2014 05:09 PM
      @diane For crying out loud!!! He had a simple knife. Even throwing a brick at him and then taking him down is just one of hundreds of examples that could have been used. Two untrained individuals could accomplish this simple task.

      Please stop protecting the murderer!
    3. Dean posted on 07/24/2014 05:36 PM
      @Mark7 And what sort of "Dealing with an armed crazy person" training have you been through that makes you, a person who WASN'T THERE, more qualified than the officer on the scene to judge what was and was not necessary?
    4. Mark7 posted on 07/25/2014 12:23 PM
      @Dean I am not going to talk circles with you. You refuse to admit Sammy was murdered. What is wrong with you?! Go do your foolish trolling elsewhere. We already have donnyp who does it here.
  4. frankie2 (not frankie) posted on 07/24/2014 11:59 AM
    How about informing officers that arriving on any scene where 20 officers are already standing down and no one is at risk of harm, then pumping nine shots into a troubled teen alone on a streetcar with his hands up during the first 20 seconds is second degree murder.

    This is not a problem of people in crisis. It is a problem of police management and recruitment.

    The report should have also rapped our inept police board.
  5. Jim posted on 07/24/2014 12:00 PM
    What a travesty. This report is more interested in preserving public opinion and favour than in preserving public safety. In crisis or not police can not wait forever to act. I just hope that this report is remembered the first time and every time an innocent bystander is killed by a mentally disturbed person while cops sat on their hands doing nothing because of this report.

    We truly have become a society of wimps. Where has the backbone in our society gone? Are we to allow our entire society to be held hostage by the whims of every nut job with a knife?

    Public safety MUST outweigh public opinion.

    I have an idea, lets fire every cop in the province and let vigilantes and shrinks control things! That will stop police shootings. It will increase the crime rate exponentially, but what the Hell no lunatics will be injured by the police.
    1. frank posted on 07/24/2014 12:11 PM
      @Jim In the video of Sammy Yatims you can clearly see that he had his hands up, while alone on the streetcar when shot by an officer who arrived after approx. 20 other officers, all of whom were standing down, and two, the only two with guns out, having reholstered their weapons, then shot the teen in less than 20 seconds.

      Why didn't the others step in and stop or even shoot the officer? He was a predator who should have been stopped. Sammy Yatim harmed no one.
    2. dama posted on 07/24/2014 12:15 PM
      @Jim What public safety are you referring to?

      There will be no report/recommendation if police had not been shooting mentally disturb persons... and it was at Bill Blair's request that Retired Supreme Court of Canada justice Frank Iacobucci do the study..

      Why would Bill Blair want this study if he thinks his police orce is doing a great and wonderful job....

      Better be wimps than to have many people with a small knife gunned down by aggressive, out of control, power hungry policeman ...

      Public safety without more shooting of mental disturb person... by police ....especially someone with a small knife and not a machine gun..

      .
      .
    3. Jim posted on 07/24/2014 12:19 PM
      @dama I have an idea, let's put you alone in a room with an armed and disturbed person and see how long it is before you're begging the cops to act.

      It's easy to be so high and mighty when you're safety isn't being put at risk by an armed lunatic.
    4. dama posted on 07/24/2014 12:28 PM
      @Jim You have a lot of ideas and opinions and I respect that..

      just because my differs from you, you want to put me with an armed person,, you are no better than a police officer.. in this instance, you are more dangerous and should be lock up in a hospital for mental assessment..

      I am not being high or mighty.. I am just stating what majority of the people that saw that Sammy Yatim's video concluded that the police on that incident used excessive force hence this retired Supreme Court of Canada justice Frank Iacobucci

      Police has the right to protect themselves but not in that incident ..
    5. Jim posted on 07/24/2014 12:39 PM
      @dama Police also have an obligation to serve and protect the public too!

      My point is simply that unless you have been in the shoe's of someone who is being held at the mercy of an armed psycho you really can't understand the fear, the desperation and terror that someone is being put through, yet you expect innocents to suffer this for the sake of the person who is causing that distress. It is completely backwards.

      Sad part is I used to feel like you until the first time I watched a woman and her child die because police waited to act against an armed lunatic.

      If it's a choice of protect the innocent or protect the armed and dangerous I'll protect the innocent every time and not feel the least bit bad about it.
    6. dama posted on 07/24/2014 01:03 PM
      @Jim You brought up good points and I agree that police have an obligation to serve and protect but from my get go I was commenting based on this report/recommendations..

      Why did Bill Blair asked Retired Supreme Court of Canada justice Frank Iacobucci to do the study and come up with recommendations?

      so this report is pertaining to Sammy Yatim's incident and ONLY based on that incidents, many have concluded that the police did not protect the public for there was no onboard that bus to protect(. Sammy was alone. .

      . so was there any danger to anyone(the public)when 3 guns were drawn and pointed at Sammy ?

      The way I see it, the recommendations and Bill Blair's implementation is going to make it better going forward for the police force.. ..
    7. Mark7 posted on 07/24/2014 01:43 PM
      @Jim So what you are saying is this. Hold those in mental duress accountable for their actions when they are incapacitated to think clearly, but officers with no excuse to murder are not held accountable. You are a sad and pathetic individual.

      "Do not try to remove a sliver from a friend's eye, when you have a log in your own". Do you know where that famous quote comes from? I shall help you out, cruel one. It is from the best book of wisdom ever written, the Bible.
    8. Suz58 posted on 07/24/2014 07:09 PM
      @Jim Haha, guess I am not alone Jim. Didn't we just have this discussion today on the story about Sammy Yatim. You called me stupid, well, it doesn't sound like I am alone. You know it alls that think shooting someone down is the only way to solve something is pretty scary! You can't shoot and ask questions later but can reverse it.

      I don't understand why this has not been in place years ago, I was told they were working on it then.

      Finally, some ideas that actually make sense!
    9. Suz58 posted on 07/24/2014 07:12 PM
      @Jim It is all in approach Jim. You should try that approach instead of attacking people for giving their opinions and thoughts, you would be amazed at how far it can get you!
    10. Suz58 posted on 07/24/2014 07:37 PM
      @Jim Yes Jim, different circumstances require different approaches. If cops or anyone is trained in how to handle such situations, you can tell just by the person's eyes, behaviour and body language how far to let it go. I agree that that situation you are referring to went on too far and long. It must have been really difficult to see that and I do understand where you are coming from.

      Yes, unfortunately it does happen. If cops are armed with the proper information, it is amazing how they can change the outcome. The workshops I was referring to earlier I thought were in Toronto but maybe this same program was out west. I know that it was making a difference.

      Thing is, any one of us could blow a gasket at any time. I would hope that if it was myself or someone I knew, someone would take the time to try to help unless of course they were shooting or even had a gun and would not cooperate with the police.

      Years ago, I was bar tending. We had the Choice rent the whole bar for a birthday party. Back then I was about 110 pounds and about 5' 3". A fight broke out between two of them. I broke it up, separated them, all was good. Then the male bartender working with me decided he was going to prove his masculinity. Now we had a fight with three guys...the male bartender, and the two Choice members. After I got them all calmed down, I called two separate cabs for the Choice and sent one of them home and the other to the hospital because as the other bartender was scrapping with the guy, the steel door slammed on his finger and smashed the bones. If the bartender would have stayed out of it, all would have been good. The next day, both the guys in the Choice came in and apologized to me.

      Different situations call for different tactics and I think it is imperative that the police have that training.

      When working with individuals with developmental disabilities, we had to take courses and use non crisis intervention. Even if they pulled a knife on us, and yes it happened, we could not harm them or we would have been charged.

      I know you don't believe it, but many situations can be diffused by mere conversation and yes, reasoning. On the other side, no, some cannot.

      Jim, I really am sorry you had to watch such a horrific scene with that mother and child, I am sure that is just embedded in your head. It does help me to understand where you are coming from.
  6. frank posted on 07/24/2014 12:07 PM
    We need a second report on police arrest deaths. There is no reason for people to be dying because they have been arrested.

    It might also help to amend the criminal code to include distinct charges for death during arrest where unreasonable force is used. The current code covers this situaition but apparently is not being used
    1. Jim posted on 07/24/2014 12:16 PM
      @frank And who decides how much force is reasonable?

      Someone who wasn't there? Someone who didn't see all the events that lead up to force being used?

      All I can say is it must be nice to be as omnipotent as you are frank.
    2. Mark7 posted on 07/24/2014 01:48 PM
      @Jim Reasonable force includes killing? Glad I don't live in your head full of violent thoughts and justification for them.
    3. Dean posted on 07/24/2014 02:32 PM
      @Mark7 The next time you're on the same streetcar as a raving lunatic with a knife, I'd like to see how quickly your definition of "reasonable force" changes.
    4. Mark7 posted on 07/24/2014 03:13 PM
      @Dean SAMMY YATIM WAS ON THE BUS ALONE WHEN SHOT!
    5. Dean posted on 07/24/2014 03:21 PM
      @Mark7 He was on the streetcar, armed with a knife, with a police officer when he was shot. A police officer who, unless you're a member of the RCMP or military or certain high-end security firms, has far more training in dealing with armed crazy people than you do, and made a judgement call to put that maniac down.

      Prior to that, of course, he was in the company of innocent people when he started screaming like a madman and waving a knife around.
    6. Masrk7 posted on 07/24/2014 05:01 PM
      @Dean who are you trying to fool? The officer who shot him was outside the bus. So do not lie to help make a point.

      If there was an officer inside the bus, he could simply leave via whichever doors were not where Sammy was. No danger there at all. I do not need their "special training" to see that it was murder by the cop. They need a gun to disarm someone carrying a knife?! That is laughable. So much for their training if this is how they approach it. Those with martial arts training would not need a gun.

      Now matter how you slice it, the cop is a stone cold murderer no bertter than the person he was supposedly trying to protect others from. Give it a rest son, You are beyond being in the wrong. It clearly shows why this world is beyond messed up, when there are those like you and your defunct thought processes.
    7. Suz58 posted on 07/24/2014 08:31 PM
      @Jim Just like the proposed report states...one task force trained in those situations and available 24/7, on every precinct. Then, all are accountable, and know how to diffuse the situation. Believe it or not, these situations can arise with almost anyone, for reason from being fired from a job, losing a girlfriend or the breakup of a marriage. It could be a confrontation that takes as little as five minutes or could go on for hours. People trained in these situations know what to look for and what strategies will or may work best.

      I think this is the best thing Toronto should seriously immerse themselves in and yes move forward within the requirements of society.
    8. 1231231 posted on 07/24/2014 11:26 PM
      @Dean "He was on the streetcar, armed with a knife, with a police officer when he was shot. A police officer who, unless you're a member of the RCMP or military or certain high-end security firms, has far more training in dealing with armed crazy people than you do, and made a judgement call to put that maniac down.

      Prior to that, of course, he was in the company of innocent people when he started screaming like a madman and waving a knife around."

      No the officer was outside the streetcar (Yatim was the only person in the streetcar). The police only moved into the streetcar to repeatedly taser the body after Yatim had been shot 9 times.

      As I stated at the time of the shooting nobody was on the streetcar and Yatim let everyone get off it before the police even arrived.

      Its funny you bring up training. In actual fact the closest officer to Yatim (much closer than the officer charged with murder) was a woman who didn't have her firearm drawn when Yatim was shot. She was the person who was by far at the most risk of being threatened by Yatim and yet had her weapon holstered. Based on your own logic then she has more training than you and assessed the situation and determined having her firearm out wasn't necessary.
    9. Suz58 posted on 07/25/2014 07:27 AM
      @Dean Hmm, knife vs. Gun/s??? Did you watch the video Dean? The person taking it on their phone was not threatened. And really EIGHT bullets and taser?
      If not mistaken, only one cop did the shooting, why did the others not? If Sammy was so out to get someone, why did he tell everyone to get of the streetcar, including the driver?
      Geez, Sammy Yatim must have had some kind of superpowers to still be a threat after hit with eight shots and still have to be tasered, holding a knife on an empty streetcar, one 18 year old against about a dozen cops, knife vs. gun.

      The only good coming out of Mr. Yatim's death and second degree murder is, hopefully the police will follow through with Non Crisis Intervention training and follow it.
  7. KenUBelievit posted on 07/24/2014 01:04 PM
    I really hope police adopt the recommendations for the sake of those people with mental issues. However, when will the rest of us get some protection from our militarized police? Check out the G20 tapes.
  8. Dean posted on 07/24/2014 01:04 PM
    I would rather see one hundred Sammy Yatims shot dead in the street before they had a chance to hurt innocent people than to see even one of those innocent people killed because a police officer was more concerned with public opinion than public safety.

    If you don't want to be shot dead by police, a wonderful place to start would be to not wave a weapon around in public and turning yourself into a danger to people around you.

    And for the people who will inevitably bring up mental illness or drugs, what does it matter? When a guy is screaming at you and waving a knife, how is he any less dangerous if his reason for doing so is that the voice in his head says you're the devil?
    1. KenUBelievit posted on 07/24/2014 01:31 PM
      @Dean You obviously didn't see the tape of the shooting. Mr. Yatims was not a threat to anyone when he was assassinated. HE WAS ALONE ON THE BUS!!!!!
    2. KenUBelievit posted on 07/24/2014 01:35 PM
      @Dean Sorry, I said assassinated when I should have said MURDERED.
    3. Dean posted on 07/24/2014 01:54 PM
      @KenUBelievit Sorry, you said murdered when you should have said "met with the perfectly logical consequences of his actions."
    4. dama posted on 07/24/2014 02:05 PM
      @Dean If it is "the perfect logical consequences of his actions" why is there 84 recommendations?

      If it is that logical James Forcillo would have been hail a hero
      but he was charged...

      .
    5. Dean posted on 07/24/2014 02:31 PM
      @dama Because somewhere along the line, public opinion became more important than public safety, and the rights and wellbeing of a lunatic with a knife became more important than the rights and wellbeing of peaceful, law-abiding citizens.

      In short, because the people of Ontario appear to be losing their damn minds.
    6. dama posted on 07/24/2014 02:57 PM
      @Dean and it is for public safety that Chief Bill Blair requested Retired Supreme Court of Canada justice Frank Iacobucci to consult with former police officers and other forces around the world to build the 84 recommendation...... "Police Encounters with People in Crisis."

      Everyone has rights, be it, sane or mentally challenged people..

      The recommendations are good.. and Chief Blair has said it will not collect dust as with previous recommendations..

      so all is good.. if implemented properly with follow ups.. you will have less mentally challenged individual innocently shot by police..hence the recommendations..
    7. Suz58 posted on 07/24/2014 07:51 PM
      @Dean I truly feel sorry for you Dean. I don't like to bring up Ford in this conversation but, look how his behaviour changed in the videos of him all hyped on crack. He spoke of killing someone, making the motions as he was punching the person he was mad at, at that time. Actually he has gone so far as to punch people. Should he have been cuffed and taken away?
      It is time the cops all got on board and on the same page as to the way they handle these situations.

      And no, Sammy Yatim was not handled properly at all! As someone said above, he had a knife, no one was on that streetcar when the cops pummelled him with eight shots and then to finish the job completely and unnecessarily, the put the taser to him. Remember, only one or a couple of the cops fired, why? I hope his family wins their lawsuit...not that it will bring their son back, but it is making for some logical change on how things can be handled differently and much more positively.
    8. Suz58 posted on 07/25/2014 07:11 AM
      @dama Very well said Dama!
    9. Suz58 posted on 07/25/2014 07:40 AM
      @Dean Dean, this is not just public opinion but public outrage!
      You are not getting it Dean. To put one of the concerns in simple, language for you....were eight shots necessary? Was it necessary to use the taser after Sammy had been shot eight times?

      From what I could see in that video, all that was visible outside the bus where the cops were, was a quivering foot of a young man laying on the floor near the door of the streetcar.

      This is a clear case of Overkill!
    10. Mark7 posted on 07/25/2014 12:31 PM
      @Suz58 Suz58, I have read all of your well thought out replies to Dean. Many of us are trying to educate him on the errors of his thinking. He refuses to man up and admit he is wrong. I for one will not waste my time replying to him any more.

      The video footage proves beyond any doubt that Sammy was brutally murdered. Dean at this point has become yet another troll on this site. :(
    11. Suz58 posted on 07/25/2014 08:52 PM
      @Mark7 Yes Mark7, I know. I thank you for the heads up.
      I know, people like that you cannot get through to. Sad but true.

      Even more disturbing is, sop cops think like he does. I hope the two cops are charged and thrown off the force. And I do wish Sammy's family all the best in their lawsuit. No, it will not bring him back but justice will be served...unfortunately too late.

      This training they are proposing is not new, I first became aware of it about six or seven years ago. Don't know why it has taken them so long.

      Message received and very much appreciated Mark7. :-)
  9. kenfromcanada posted on 07/24/2014 04:01 PM
    when is wynne gonna clamp down on her union buddy's and get them to answer to the public instead of hiding in their police association union halls?
    1. Just Asking posted on 07/25/2014 05:34 AM
      @kenfromcanada And your comment has what to do with the Toronto Police ... or the Toronto Police Association ?

      Nothing, of course - just a stupid comment from a typical uneducated Con supporter who doesn't seem to know his elbow from his a$$.
  10. AdrianoC1981 posted on 07/24/2014 09:43 PM
    You people are all sick on the head. Yes the cops should have shot the mental kid with the knife. This should be a lesson to anybody else who decides to wave a knife, gun bow and freaking arrow for god sakes not to do this within the general population. Why should people with mental health issues get treated differently for the rest of society. What if they didn't shoot the mental kid, then down the road he sawed someone's head off on the bus/streetcar,MANITOBA GREYHOUND, or ran over a cop or one of your family members with a F-N SNOWPLOW!!!! Wake up everybody, mental health issues need to be dealt with swiftly. Our cops should not have to worry about asking criminals if they're sain or not. Or if they took their meds today. I hope that one day none of you defending this psycho kid have to deal with a mental patient and need the cops to help you. KARMA'S A REAL BITCH.
    1. Suz58 posted on 07/25/2014 07:06 AM
      @AdrianoC1981 Yes, KARMA IS A BITCH! thank you for your opinion but you know not what you speak!
    2. Karl Burgin posted on 07/25/2014 10:22 AM
      @AdrianoC1981 1.> Yes there are stark similarities between the Greyhound bus and this TTC streetcar. But there are also glaring differences too. The major one being, there was NO ONE on the streetcar. Yatim got everyone off. He should have been talked down like a person- or at the very most tased. Not shot down like a dog.
      The guy on the Greyhound bus in the middle of eating a person's head got a lot more leniency for doing much worse.
      2.>The snow plow incident, while gravely unfortunate, was also an accident. Although I do have an issue with doctors trying to accelerate Mr. Kashkar's release.
      3.>Cops should not have to be trained in talking mental psychotic breakdown situations per se- that really isn't part of their job description. But they should be trained enough to be able to differentiate criminal activity from a mental situation- and not try use the same approach for both scenarios.
      The police are there to serve and protect- even if its the citizen from doing harm to himself. No where in there does it include shoot first, and ask questions later. Unless their life is in grave danger of course.
    3. Mark7 posted on 07/25/2014 12:35 PM
      @AdrianoC1981 "KARMA'S A REAL BITCH."

      With the vile poison you just spouted, you will have bad karma coming after you. Your reply is the most idiotic and heartless on this forum. Mum must be so proud of you.
    4. dama posted on 07/25/2014 01:07 PM
      @AdrianoC1981 Would yo like a police officer to shoot you if you look at him with twitching eyes??

      That's basically what you were saying?? Cops shoud use their brains and common sense in different situations.. small knife.. contain the area. stay 15 feet away and STOP SHOUTING.. "drop that knife you fxxking shxt."...

      Snowplough incident,, cop fired and slipped. he was just detroying properties, not humna lives..

      Greyhound.. (bad example) that was a freaking crazy one.. no one .. not even cop could stop that..

      How about the Vancouver airport situation.. guy just came over from Europe, does not speak English.. tasered to death by cops..and cops tried to covered up unil a video was produced that showed cops used excessive force..

      Sad to say.. AdrianoC1981, you have bad karma... be safe crossing the road..
  11. AdrianoC1981 posted on 07/25/2014 03:16 PM
    To all of you who responded to my post, I respect your opinions on the matter but put yourself in my shoes for a minute. I live on a quiet cul de sac in the city and have 3 children with one on the way. Sounds great right? Well, on this cul de sac lives a person with some "mental health" issues as the police have stated numerous times. This person has threatened to hit, kill, smack, stab all the children on the street, including my own and the police cannot do anything about it because for some reason or another people with "mental health" issues are untouchable in the eyes of the law. This is a bunch of bullshit!!!!! If someone cannot handle being amongst the general public, threatens kids or adults, then maybe they should be put in a home where they will not be able to harm others or tgemselves for that matter and the police can go out and do their job which is to serve and protect the law abiding citizens of this great city. I have lost a great deal of respect for the police in this city, not because they shout Sammy Yatin, but because they allow people like the crazy person I have to deal with everyday of my life to roam free with the rest of us sane people. So, before you judge me and think I am some sort of a-hole, that's just a little taste of the mental health issues I deal with on a daily basis. Sorry if anyone got offended by my original post. If your kids were threatened EVERYDAY by a nut job, I'm sure you would feel the same way.
    1. KenUBelievit posted on 07/25/2014 04:36 PM
      @AdrianoC1981 I think we all know who's the nut case on your street.
    2. Suz58 posted on 07/25/2014 11:16 PM
      @AdrianoC1981 Ok, now we do have two different situations. Yes, the police should be doing something about this individual who is threatening your children and others. I do not know why the police say they cannot do anything but no, you should not have to live like that. I have worked with individuals with developmental disabilities and in my experience there was the odd person, (not much different than anyone) in the way that a certain trigger or reminder could set them off. For the most part I would say and of course it depends on the disability on how they would react to situations. Much of the problem with people with developmental disabilities is, even though they are and adult physically, they may have the intellectual capacity of a young child, thus, they do not always understand what or why things happen as they do. Their world is very literal.

      Many of the individuals I worked with needed to be taught how to behave and interact appropriately in the community...it really is a process and very intense, needing much consistency, patience, explaining The way the disability act reads is that people with developmental disabilities are entitled like anyone to partake in any community events or anything and should not be discriminated against. With that said, it does not mean that they are entitled to special treatment. This is where this whole crisis intervention would be beneficial for your situation. Then if you were to make a complaint for a threat he makes to you and your family, they would have the team of workers investigate further and make recommendations on what would be the best course of action.
      I would find out if he is living with family, a monitor family or an organization.
      If he is problematic in the community, yes, the police can do something about it. I have supported a couple of individuals that were in fact arrested for wrong doing and rightly so. This is the real problem, the police do not know or have training on how to proceed in these situations. People with developmental disabilities are net

      If this guy live with his family, and they do not listen to you about your concerns, the police would be the next course of action. If like you say, they do nothing, lI would then take it to the ombudsman or even call community living or better yet, near you and explain it and get some recommendations from them as to who you can contact is
      http://www.mentalhealthhelpline.ca. They would probably be able to direct you and peossibly give you more valuable information on who give you help and direct you to get this to stop this. I did work with people with DD that were charged legally.

      I truly understand what you are going through and I have supported individuals with DD but when a cop says there is nothing they can do, I refer to this as reverse discrimination.

      That is why this training and crisis intervention will prove to be a positive step because in fact, again they are taking precautions to keep your family safe. This way, the psychologist and police can work together with all, using information provided.

      Please remember that it really depends on this person's diagnosis and will then know, they can help in a way that
      They are trained in law and psychological issues. They must be dealt with in a united front.

      I do believe your story and Sammy Yatim's cases are quite different issues.

      I wish you all the best and if it were me, I would try several avenues to get a true diagnosis and how to intervene effectively for all involved.

      Please, if there is anything I can do to help just reply to this post.

      I totally understand what you are going through I also agree with you on this one and something should be done.
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